In the lead-up to the referendum, a number of South Asian community leaders have stepped up to encourage their communities to vote ‘Yes’. South Asian Australians are largely migrants and are at a disadvantage when it comes to understanding First Nations history and issues – and this understanding isn’t much stronger for those of us who were born here.
Khushaal Vyas of Desis for Yes and Kersherka Sivakumaran from South Asians for Voice are hoping to change that.
Note: The following answers were edited for brevity. Some sentences have been bolded for ease of reading.
What challenges have you faced when trying to reach the South Asian diaspora in Australia?
Khushaal Vyas: We have genuinely been really stoked… by the level of curiosity and interest within the South Asian community. I think our community is one that is very empathetic, is one that knows what that colonial experience is like, and is one that wants to do the right thing.
Going beyond the obvious barriers [of] language, I think there's a broader challenge in terms of the migrant experience. One of the things that we come across is an unwillingness to engage, not because they're not empathetic and not because they might not have an opinion, but because they don't want to be seen to be part of a campaign. They're afraid [of being seen as] rocking the boat.
I can, to a degree, empathise with that. I can understand my parents' generation… people who came here who would have maybe faced issues of being seen as different, maybe not fully being accepted as Australian and having to go through that entire experience, work really hard and be able to find their place in Australia. The ironic part is that showcasing our view and being part of this cements that we all are Australian. Regardless of your background, we all are being asked to vote on this. We are being asked by indigenous Australians to vote on this and it is the mark of us, as part of this Australian democracy, that we get that chance and that we make sure we use that chance responsibly and effectively.
Kersherka Sivakumaran: I have a personal challenge, which is how to communicate the issue without trying to compare our experiences to First Nations people's experiences. There are parallels; a lot of South Asian people left their homelands because they were actively excluded or discriminated against. But you never want to convolute specific situations.
Other challenges have been accessing the people who are undecided or no voters. A key component of our campaign is about leveraging the strengths of our community: we are a community of talkers, who love to tell stories. We are a community that is incredibly connected… what we did find as we reached more and more into our networks is [that] we tend to hang around with people like us as well. And so being able to access the people who we probably really need to be having conversations with has been harder.
There [is] a challenge around people knowing they're gonna want to vote yes, but not really knowing how to articulate it. [In our] video campaign, which is all about people talking about why they're voting yes, there's a lot of fear around saying the wrong thing. Most of these people have probably never met an Aboriginal person in their life. It isn't necessarily a barrier because these people are voting yes, but it makes it hard for some of the South Asians [to] advocate because they don't necessarily have the vocabulary… to describe it. Some people who said to me [they were worried] because of work and future job prospects. Some people have legal issues, like they're quite senior in their careers and they can't do any sort of media comms without approval.
The thing that was really nice is actually the older generation… are the ones who have the best one liners. I remember someone has said to me once, "How many times can we say no to the Aboriginal people? This is ridiculous. It shouldn't even be a vote." I found the older generation a lot more articulate on the issue, and [were] able to kind of draw on their experiences. Some of them [said things like], "I've been part of a country that's been divided by race and I come here to not do that to anyone else. We know what it's like to live in a place where you've got incredibly different outcomes for different sets of people. So we'll do anything to help the community to be able to move forward from that.”
What do you have to say to South Asians who are still unsure who to vote for?
Vyas: If we regard ourselves as Australians, we have a duty to become informed about what we are voting for. I think that South Asians are knowledgeable enough to ensure that we don't buy into “vote no if you don’t know”. If you don’t know, let’s find out, and there are plenty of avenues [to find out].
To the South Asian community, I want to say that all of us should actually be able to lead from experience here. All of us, particularly those who have that understanding of that colonial background [in South Asia], know the impact of colonialism. We still feel those impacts in South Asia today. So you can imagine, for people who have never been given that chance for self-determination, of course, they're still facing those issues. Indigenous Australians are not even asking for independence in this proposal. All they are asking for is simply to have a chance to have a voice, to have a say and a seat at the table on the matters that impact them. And we, as South Asians, should be able to understand those barriers and that pain.
Sivakumaran: I just posted a video on my Instagram called ‘Ring Your Relos’, and it's a campaign that the Uluru Statement is running. I called uncles and aunties I haven't talked to in years. That's been the best tactic so far. I had an auntie who said, "Actually, I do need some more information." And I was like, "Do you want to read things?" She's like, "No, I prefer to chat." So we talked about it. She asked questions like “Why are the incarceration rates so high? Why is intoxication and domestic violence high?” It was hard for me to articulate [my answers].
I'm going to do some deep thinking about how I talk to this better, but the South Asian community, most likely not knowing any Aboriginal people directly themselves, are quite susceptible to the perceptions of the media of Aboriginal people. I could tell at the end of that conversation that my aunt believed what I was saying about the Voice, but if I’m going to be really honest, I feel like she still had a level of scepticism of the ability of Aboriginal people to manage their own affairs. It destroyed my heart because I can proudly say I know so many Aboriginal people who are playing such a big role in the community, who are loving and caring people – which is the most important thing – but [they] are lawyers and they're activists and they're writers. I can talk to that, but if at the end of the day, all [South Asians have] seen is the media, it's hard to persuade them if they don't believe in that fundamental ethos – that when systems of support are designed by people with lived experience, you're setting up people for success.
What do you have to say to South Asians who have decided to vote ‘no’?
Vyas: There is an undeniable fact that there was an active effort to breed Indigenous Australians out. [It is] a culture that has survived for 65,000 years, and within less than a century of Captain Cook and British colonials arriving, [they] were almost decimated. As Australians, obviously we should be ashamed of that. That history of stealing children from their mothers and their families, that history of telling them not to celebrate their culture, telling them not to speak in their language when we do so in our community functions so proudly... we cannot, as South Asian Australians, deny that history.
The biggest criticism amongst [‘no’ voters] is that this is racially divisive… [but] Australia is already a divided country. Indigenous Australians, compared to non-Indigenous Australians, do have a big divide when it comes to life expectancy, when it comes to health, when it comes to justice, when it comes to economic outcomes. In all of those departments, the gap is getting worse. This proposal is the first step towards actually bridging that gap in the first place.
The second point a lot of people [have is] "Oh, but what about the economics? What about, you know, we already spend millions of dollars on indigenous issues. So why should we spend more?" I don't accept the premise, but let's pretend that we hypothetically do spend enough. Clearly, the way that we're doing it isn't working. Wouldn't it make more sense from an economically efficient perspective to actually consult the people who are actually impacted by our policy to make sure that the money goes where it needs to go? That makes the most economic sense. So even if we're left wing or progressive or conservative, or wherever we might fit on the political spectrum, this fits the bill for everyone.
Some people will [say], "Oh, doesn't that mean now we'll have to have an Indian voice department, a Chinese voice department?” That's why acknowledging and understanding our history in Australia is really important. We are not the first Australians. We are here on the land of people who are dispossessed where sovereignty was never ceded. We have all benefited from that dispossession. We [need to] do our part to ensure that we put our hand forward and take up the generous invitation they've given us to walk with them towards that brighter future. It's not that difficult.
Sivakumaran: From the survey, I think [we’ve] had a lot of undecided-leaning-'yes' conversations, a handful of undecided-leaning-'no' conversations. Both of those parties were purely just sort of waiting for new information. My main way of combating anyone who is at least leaning towards 'no' is to ask really curious questions to get to the crux of it. If someone makes a bold, sweeping statement, like "I'm voting 'no', because Aboriginal people don't really want this", asking the questions around that. What makes you think Aboriginal people feel that way? Have you looked at the Statement from the Heart? Do you know where it all came from? And from there, it's trying to be genuinely understanding of their perspective and then providing them with information I have. And I always end with official neutral government information. It's not no stuff, it's not Yes23 stuff. I am approaching this from the perspective that when people have real information and let it sink in, they will actually just vote yes. Because it makes so much sense.
Upfront, I like to determine whether I think this is a persuadable person who I can have a constructive conversation with. If I do feel like it's a hard 'no', and it's going to be destructive, I save myself the anguish and the pain. I don't see a point in trying to have persuasive conversations with [them].
Desis For Yes are a grassroots volunteer group and are active on social media: Instagram, Twitter, Facebook.
South Asians for Voice is a non-political group hoping to inspire more South Asian Australians into activism ahead of the vote. Their website is here.
